Interview with Mark Hocknell

Mark Hocknell & Jack Ferguson

Profit By Design, Customer Centricity, And Segmenting Your Customers on What They Value, with Mark Hocknell

Today’s guest is Mark Hocknell, Author of Profit By Design: How to Create A Customer Portfolio Full of Profitable Promoters.

Mark’s experience spans three decades and covers line management roles, consulting, and academia.

In the early 2000’s he lead one of Australia’s first large-scale CRM initiatives, has had an extensive career in consulting, and has taught at the Graduate School of Business at QUT.

Today he runs his own consulting practice focusing on applying a customer-centric approach to business and performance measurement. He has an MBA, and certifications in change management and PuMP.

In this episode we speak about:

– How Managers and Leaders misuse KPI’s, and how they encourage the wrong behaviours.

– The importance of unpacking complexity for customer experience

– How to think about your customer portfolio.

– How to segment your customers, (and it’s not by demographics, it’s by value)


– What benefits Mark got from writing a book.

This is the second time Mark has been on the podcast and he certainly didn’t disappoint.

You can find Mark at:Linkedin


Show Notes:

3:00 What is the issue with the way managers use KPI’s?

5:45 Have you seen the culture around KPI’s change recently?

10:45 What is the difference between a goal and a KPI?

13:35 Is a goal better to give to a team rather than an individual?

15:20 Why are many people reluctant to unpack complexity?

18:20 How do you know what parts of your customer experience to fix?

20:30 What got you into working for yourself?

22:55 Do you remember the moment you decided to go out on your own?

26:35 Was working for yourself what you expected?

28:55 How long did it take you to have the discipline in your own business?

29:25 What would you say to the person who started your business?

30:30 Why did you write your book ‘Profit By Design’?

35:15 What is the Net Promoter Score?

43:25 Why did you need to write the book?

46:50 What were the benefits of writing a book for you?

51:10 How is the culture around customer centricity changing?

57:45 What should you do instead of sales and marketing?

1:01:00 What are your goals for the future?

Resources, People, and Companies Mentioned:

Gartner Customer Experience Report


Nude By Nature

Net Promoter Score

Bain & Co Net Promoter Score Research

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